When You Stop Pretending to be Holy for Survival
Interview By Brandi Fleck
Tia Coffey, a mom, Yaya, life coach, and operations consultant based just south of Nashville, Tenn.
This is a transcript of the conversation between myself, Brandi Fleck, Host of the Human Amplified podcast, and Tia Coffey, a former evangelical Christian who’s spent the last ten years deconstructing and healing. This is her story.
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Table of Contents:
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What does being human mean to you?
Brandi Fleck:
What does being human mean to you?
Tia Coffey:
Being human to me is feeling a lot of feelings very deeply all at once while also navigating other people's feelings and trying to, I guess, figure out who I am in the midst of all of that.
Brandi Fleck:
That's beautiful. Thank you.
Who Is Tia Coffey
Brandi Fleck:
Everybody, today I am super excited to introduce you to my friend Tia Coffey. She is a helper to her core. She loves to problem solve, encourage, and support others. With three adult children and a grandson, being a mom and Yaya are her favorite roles. She is passionate about inclusivity, mental health, and lifting people up in the hardest moments of life. And in her professional career, Tia serves nonprofits and small businesses as an operations consultant and is also a practicing life coach based out of Thompson Station, Tennessee.
[3:11] And much of what we'll be talking about today is as a previous evangelical Christian, much of Tia's life was overshadowed by the high-control religious group she and her family were part of. So she spent the last decade trying to heal and untangle from that belief system. So Tia, welcome to the show.
Tia Coffey:
[3:32] Thank you so much, Brandi. I'm happy to be here. Yeah. And before we even jump in, let me just say it is really brave of you to share your story. So thank you. Yeah, I acknowledge that. Okay. Yeah. All right. So before we dive really deep and before I give context to our discussion, what else do you want people to know about who you are and what you do? Well, I think really the essence of who I am today, it really just, it revolves around my relationships. You know, I am, for people familiar with the Enneagram, I'm an Enneagram too. We are known for being very heart-centered and we're very outward focused. So I'm constantly trying to find my place in the world in relation to the people around me. And my relationships are just core for me. I'm also just really embracing this sort of middle life stage. I'll be 50 this year and, you know, I have a two-year-old grandson and one on the way. We just found out yesterday that it's a boy.
Brandi Fleck:
Congratulations.
Tia Coffey:
[4:43] I'll be a grandma of two little boys. And, you know, I'm really just kind of embracing this phase of life. I'm sort of like finding a lot of joy in like taking care of plants and backyard birdwatching and breeding and drinking tea. And I'm like, oh, I really, like, I love this space. It sounds wonderful. You know, I've really, being a mom has been a really important part of my life. It's the thing I'm most proud of. I think it's the most important thing I've ever done. It's the only thing I ever knew for sure I wanted to do with my life. And, you know, there were definitely some years where there was that sense of like, I'm just a mom. But now, from the vantage point I have now, I'm like, that is such important work. It was very important work for becoming me. You know, your kids really help you become while you're also helping them become. And it's just, for me, it's been a very beautiful relationship with my three kids. I have two daughters and a son. And my relationship with my own mother was core for me and very beautiful. And so that's sometimes I'm like, I wish I had a bigger story. But I do think that that's a big story.
Brandi Fleck:
[6:03] Absolutely. Really important.
Tia Coffey:
So and I work. I have a job. I'm a business owner. I don't really feel like that's a big part of my identity. It's kind of like what I do to survive. You know, I think some people really identify with their work. And it's a big part of their identity for me, not so much.
Brandi Fleck:
[6:25] That's awesome.
Tia Coffey:
I enjoy it. It's good. I like the relationship part of it, but the work I do, I don't feel like I'm hoping that maybe down the road, I'll be able to do some things professionally that are a little more meaningful to me.
When People Realize The Religion They Follow is Wrong
Brandi Fleck:
[6:38] Thank you for sharing all of that. I do think that was really beautiful and it is a big story.
So as we start to get deeper into your story, I do want to give a little bit of context because we're at a time right now in our society that so many people are using religion as an excuse to hate, oppress, and divide.
And we know there's been a rise in white Christian nationalism that's fueling the Nazi movement, and also that's a theme that underlies Trump's administration. And while this episode isn't directly about that, and it might not necessarily be political, there are a lot of lessons that can be gleaned from your personal journey and away from your personal journey away from the church and deconstructing evangelical and fundamentalist Christianity that will help people moving forward as they realize they need to separate themselves from this path of control and hate. I do think more people will choose this path away from high-control religion as they realize it's not okay to discard humans, it's not okay to treat people poorly in the name of religion, and that what's going on in the name of religion isn't real love or God.
[7:50] So when this starts to happen, I think people are going to be afraid. They'll be experiencing cognitive dissonance. They'll need to overcome it. They'll need to figure out what's next, which isn't really easy. I think it's a huge undertaking, but I hope they know that they can do it just like you did. So I know that's a lot, but what are your thoughts on that?
Tia Coffey:
[8:13] Yeah. Well, first, I really hope you're right. I hope that this time in history is pivotal for change. I hope that a lot of people leave high-control religion. And, you know, I want to like disclaimer, when I say the church, I'm talking about my church experience. I'm not talking about the church as a whole. I think that there's some really wonderful things about the church and the people in the church, but I will use the church to talk about my experience with the church. But I also think like, you know, the extremism, the hate, that has been around for forever and for a really long time. And MAGA has just like kind of put it in the spotlight.
[9:01] And that's bad in some ways. But I also hope like what you're saying, I hope that will be good in some ways to kind of show some people that like, oh, this isn't for me. I'm not, I don't want to be part of this extremism. And when that happens, yeah, it does create, like you said, that cognitive dissonance of like, who am I and what have I been taking part in? And like, I think the most important thing it was for me is just like finding your people in the midst of that, because there will be a lot of others going through that, you know, and key for getting out of any high-control group is getting support. Because it can be very difficult to do, especially when that's been your life. It's been mostly all you've known. And getting professional help too.
Brandi Fleck:
Yeah. Those are excellent points.
Growing Up in the Evangelical Church
Brandi Fleck:
So Tia, what was your life like coming up in the church or your church?
Tia Coffey:
Yeah. So for me, my childhood was really marked, like the first half of my childhood was really marked by poverty. I have a hard time kind of figuring out how much of that related to my family's involvement in the church and how much of that would have been present anyway. And [10:29] Surrounding all of that.
But I do think that the particular groups we were part of sort of glorified this like suffering for God. And it kind of normalized this sort of impoverished life. And so, that in itself is traumatizing as a child. I did, like we experienced family homelessness. And incidentally, we ended up living in what was an old abandoned schoolhouse. I grew up in Kansas, and this was in the winter. It was cold.
[11:05] It's part of that trauma for me, because I know at the time, my dad was really trying to follow a calling that he believed the church had on his life that put us in that situation. So, it was like, there were things that I didn't understand as a child, but looking back, I'm like, that was not good. That was not healthy and it didn't make me feel safe. There were a lot of things about being in the church that felt that way to me that just didn't feel safe. There were some pretty extreme indoctrinations, even when you were a child.
So one of my first memories, I think it was probably about seven uh the church that we went to they showed these videos they were do you know what i'm talking about when I say rapture?
Brandi Fleck:
Yes.
Tia Coffey:
Okay yep, so they were rapture videos and i think they were kind of just like fear propaganda and they would basically show like people either who weren't raptured and what would happen to them if they like were left behind and what you're talking about yeah and so one of my earliest memories so I was only like I said like six seven and I came home from a friend's house and in one of these movies that they showed at church there was somebody came into like a kitchen and there was a pot of boiling water on the stove and nobody was around because they'd been raptured.
Related: Escaping the Control of Spiritual Abuse
[12:33] Well, I came home from my friend's house down the street. You know where I'm going with this. There was a pot of boiling water on the stove.
[12:44] Okay, here's where I get emotional.
And there was nobody around. And we lived in a single white trailer. So you couldn't just not see people if they were home. And I just started to panic. And I thought I'd been left behind. And I just started screaming for my mom. And she came running in the back door with tomatoes in her hand she had been out in the garden picking tomatoes and she was just what honey what i was you know just i can't remember but I probably you know I thought that you were raptured yeah there were things like that that you know that's a story that clearly traumatized me.
I don't know how much time you want me to spend on this, but I have a lot of stories like that. Like I recall being in someone's basement in their home and it was like a children's kind of service, you know, while the adults were at church, we were there and they were teaching us to speak in tongues.
[13:48] So, are you familiar with that? Like in the evangelical church, there are gifts of the spirit and one that's really emphasized, or at least was when I was in the church, was this gift of tongues. And they were kind of teaching us to, it was kind of like, if you fake it, if you pretend you have it, then it shows that you have faith and you will get it. And so for years, I pretended to have the gift of tongues. And I knew I didn't. I faked it forever.
[14:24] And so I think, I don't know how to sum that up, but it's like my childhood felt like it was a lot of performing and a lot of trying to fit in to this community that often felt really confusing and unsafe. But yet there was this reward of sort of like, oh, you're so in tune with the Holy Spirit for a child. Or do you know what I mean?
And again, that's, as we know, oftentimes a function of high-control groups where there's sort of this reward as long as you're in alignment and conforming to the system. Yeah. Also just isolating. We didn't have a television. We weren't allowed to listen to pop music.
[15:17] I did go to public school, but that often felt isolating because I didn't understand the pop culture references or I just felt really out of touch with culture. But as I got older and I got more and more indoctrinated, that was like a source of pride because you were set apart. There was a lot of like word salad-y stuff in the evangelical church and it would be like, we're in the world but not of the world.
[15:50] And so, as I became like a preteen and a teenager, I did things like leading a Bible study at school and, you know, putting petitions out to have prayer at graduation and just became this really devout. And it was sincere. Like, I really did truly believe, you know, that God loved me and that I was on earth to serve Him. And so, it was very sincere and it was a really big part of who I was.
But there was also again just a lot of confusion and you know that was a big I grew up in the 80s and 90s and you know I was in high school in the early 90s and purity culture was just really exploding at that time and there were books coming out and there were you know a lot of teachings about like courtship I don't know if you're familiar with that but the idea of like waiting for marriage and only dating for, you know, the end goal of marriage.
And so, my parents didn't really buy into that too much, which was good for me, but it was still just everywhere you went, you know, and I think a lot of people who were in those types of churches who are my age have found themselves untangling from all of that because it was such a big part of our programming and indoctrination.
Should I Stay or Leave This Religion? This Marriage?
Brandi Fleck:
[17:16] Yeah, that's a lot. So what happened that prompted you to start questioning whether or not you wanted a different kind of life and if what was happening was even okay?
Tia Coffey:
You know, there were always, I always sort of had this [17:35] kind of rebellious streak, I guess. I never fully bought into the religion part of it, to the constructs. I bought into the beauty of a relationship with God. I bought into what I now call like the mystic part of it. Because for me, that was very real and it's still real.
But I also had parents who were that way. And I think that that was a big saving grace for me. They were really, they never like fully bought in to the control. They would just leave a church. So, that helped me because we did bounce around from church to church because they would see things they didn't like and they would leave. So, and then also just growing up and sort of having opportunities to see the world for what it really was. Because when you're sort of isolated and in those teachings, I mean, we went to church like three times a week, sometimes more. You know, there was always opportunities.
You were supposed to only spend time with people that believe the same thing as you. For the longest time, I believed my friends, even those who went to church, were probably going to hell because they didn't believe the same thing that we believed.
Brandi Fleck:
Yeah.
Tia Coffey:
[18:58] Which is outrageous. But I think, like I said, there was always this questioning about really becoming an adult and recognizing that I can think critically.
I don't believe a lot of what they're saying, particularly those more extreme and sort of judgmental teachings like the anti-homosexuality message, the purity culture message, the othering of people. We have a corner on the market of salvation and everybody else is deceived. And just it didn't add up. And I also saw enough things.
There was a lot of really wild stuff that I witnessed in the church and claims of prophetic things and this is going to happen. And God said, and I'm this prophet and I'm telling you, and then it wouldn't happen. And so, I guess maybe I just had enough logic to be like, yeah, this doesn't seem real. But the biggest thing I think that happened, two things. One was that I often, I worked in the church when I got older, and I often found myself in this position of supporting leaders in the church.
[20:19] And so I kind of got to see behind the curtain.
Brandi Fleck:
Ooh, yeah. And what you saw in a service was different than what you saw in the office or behind the curtain?
Tia Coffey:
[20:37] It wasn't anything scandalous, at least not all of it, but it was just this sort of, I guess, just like two-facedness. And those leaders were often in public sort of uplifting me and saying, oh, I couldn't do this without Tia. You know, she's my right-hand gal and she's so wonderful. And then behind the scenes, they would just be picking me apart and telling me just petty little things that I would do. They would somehow equate that to like sin or rebelliousness.
I once had a female pastor that I supported and she, this is just an example. She had had an office space at the church, but she had taken her office home so she could be close to her kids. And so, they gave me her cubicle and her phone. And I just started. And the office manager said, set up your voicemail. So, I set up my voicemail. And the next meeting I had with this female pastor, she told me that I was, she quoted a verse from Proverbs, that I was being wise in my own eyes and went on this long tirade of how I needed to be more submissive to authority because I had taken her voicemail box.
[22:01] That's just one example of just, you know, kind of the kooky stuff that I went through. So, all these, I mean, obviously, I'm 50 almost, you know, there was years and years because I've only really been out of the church for like the last 10. There were just years and years of that and so many stories of things that didn't align.
And then the biggest part of it for me really was my marriage. So I like so many other people who were teenagers and young adults during that purity movement. We got married way too young and we had no idea who we were yet. I met my ex-husband when I was 19. He was 21. We got married a year later.
[22:49] And we both thought we were doing the right thing, but we were completely incompatible.
But then also divorce is such a shameful thing in fundamental Christianity that I probably spent a good 10 years just becoming more and more miserable in my marriage. And obviously, we don't have time to go into all of that. But I reached out to the church for support and help in a relationship that was becoming increasingly toxic, and that I felt just helpless in doing anything about. But of course, marriage is such an important thing in fundamental Christianity, and it really mirrors, like, the marriage relationship mirrors the relationship between God and the church, and it's one of patriarchy, really.
[23:43] It's submitting as a woman to your husband pretty much no matter what. I mean, there are a few exceptions, but it was really coming to a place of honestly being suicidal that awakened me.
Brandi Fleck:
Wow.
Tia Coffey:
Where I had three children that I loved. I had people in my life. I just couldn't imagine doing that to them, but I felt so hopeless and so helpless that [24:21] that was becoming a fixation. And I knew I had to do something. And so I started going to therapy and therapy was really a huge catalyst for me leaving the church. I learned so much. I had a wonderful therapist and I worked with her for like five years on just untangling all of it and giving myself permission to want something different.
[24:50] And believing that I could do it.
Brandi Fleck:
There's so much there. Like I have so many questions I want to ask you. So let me just say that I've noticed that the theme of like sort of two-facedness has come up several times while you're talking, like with the tongues and faking it until you make it basically. And then behind the scenes, what the leaders were doing didn't line up with what they were doing in public.
[25:17] And then there was this sort of theme of submitting to authority and you have to, I guess what's interesting about what you brought up about that authority is that it's not always from God, right? Like this woman who was upset about you taking her voicemail, I don't see how that had anything to do with God. So there were these things that were happening that didn't line up, if I could summarize it. And then real quick, let me just ask, did the leaders of the church have a problem with therapy?
Tia Coffey:
Oh, yes. Definitely. Going to, first of all, getting counseling outside of the church was frowned upon. And of course, I mean, even someone who went to seminary, which a lot of the pastors and leaders in the churches I went to didn't, because there's really no regulation around that. If you're a non-denominational church, you're not bound to any kind of educational requirements. But even the ones who went to seminary, they have a very small amount of training in counseling, and particularly not with any particular emphasis on marriage or family or things like that. And then if you did go to counseling, it needed to be through a Christian organization.
Brandi Fleck:
[26:45] So they could maintain control, essentially?
Tia Coffey:
I mean, you know, I try not to assign negative intent to all of it because I recognize that the people who were setting the rules were also indoctrinated. That's a really good point. Even now, as I watch the news and I listen to people and, you know, we have this thing in Tennessee right now where there's this covenant marriage bill. Have you read about this? I have. Yeah. Just a little bit. I mean, I read that and it infuriates me.
[27:20] But at the same time, I'm like, of course they think they're doing the right thing.
Brandi Fleck:
That's a really good perspective that I think a lot of people don't think about.
Tia Coffey:
Right. Which is why it's as angry as I still am with some of the people who controlled me, I also forgive them and understand why they were doing it. It's like the system's the problem. Yeah. Which also makes it really hard to figure out how to change it. Because we were talking a little bit about if they frowned on therapy because that was a big part of you getting out. Yes. And that was huge for me. And...
[28:07] It was my ex-husband, who's still very much in this type of religion. He did not like me going to therapy. He did not like the things that I was challenging him on as I was going to therapy. And that was just for the first year that I was in therapy, we were together. And one of the things, I think back on some of the messages I got during that time from the people around me. One of the things was, you know, you cannot get divorced without biblical grounds. And which would be like, for those who don't know, would be like abuse, like physical abuse, abandonment, or potentially depending on what church you go to, if your spouse leaves the church or like renounces their faith and then infidelity. And even then, it kind of depends on what church you go to. Okay. So those were the biblical grounds.
So the message was, this came from someone close to me, if you get divorced, you don't have biblical grounds to get divorced. And if you do that, God cannot bless you. To which I responded because I had already started to deconstruct:
[29:23] You can believe in that God. I don't. That's not what I believe anymore. The God I believe in wants to bless me, and it's not dependent on whether or not I stay in a toxic marriage.
[29:37] And then, you know, just being told, like, I would do irreparable damage to my children if I left, to which I knew I'm going to do way worse irreparable damage to my children because I'm seriously thinking about killing myself.
Brandi Fleck:
Yeah, nothing worse than that, really.
Tia Coffey:
You know, lesser of two evils here.
[29:59] So there were a lot of messages, people who were well-meaning, who wanted to try to get me back on track during that time. But I think the chains had already kind of fallen off. So I was able to think critically and refute those things. But yeah, it's incredibly difficult.
And I wasn't even – I know that I had a lot of support. And I'm incredibly grateful. So I don't want to communicate in any way of like, oh, it's so simple. I just decided I was going to do it. Yeah.
Brandi Fleck:
Well, to that point, before you started deconstructing, it seems like you probably had lots of complex emotions that came up that you had to deal with to even take the step into outside therapy or to even think about, okay, it's time to leave my marriage. What emotions did come up for you that you had to grapple with?
Tia Coffey:
It was such an internal battle daily. I didn't realize at the time that, that I was deconstructing. I just thought, I've got to get out of this marriage.
[31:10] And I didn't, I wasn't, it's kind of positive because I wasn't aware that I was leaving the church. And looking back now, I think I would have thought that meant I was leaving God, which was such a huge part of my identity. I think it was kind of a mercy that I didn't recognize that because it would have been more than it would have been overwhelming. It would have been just more than I could possibly handle.
[31:41] But, you know, there was a lot of shame involved for me. And again, I'm talking more about the divorce part of it because I can't really separate the two. My deconstruction and my divorce were so like they were, it was like a three-legged race. I think of just like, you know, they were tied together and I was kind of walking with both of them, I felt really, I felt duped. I felt a lot of anger because I had been such a rule follower and I had been so devout from such a young age. I took my faith very seriously and I thought church was that faith. I thought the things I was being taught were, because of course I was a child, I couldn't separate the two. And so I felt really angry and deceived because I had been taught, you follow these rules and life will be good and beautiful. And you will have, you know, a loving husband who takes care of you and your church will take care of you and life will be lovely.
And that was not my story at all.
[32:49] And so there was a lot of frustration and anger, a lot of anger to deal with, [32:56] which is not an emotion that I have good access to personality-wise. And so that was challenging for me.
God After Leaving Fundamentalist Christianity
Brandi Fleck:
Well, what is your relationship with God like now?
Tia Coffey:
I don't really feel like I have a relationship with God.
I don't think about God.
And I think that's because I don't know how to see God yet.
And this may come for me. I don't know how to see God in a way outside of the way I was taught. So I can't love God or trust God. I don't know.
[33:41] Because it was such a source of pain and trauma for me. I definitely do not ever think of God as a man. I will never engender God again. I think that probably if there is a higher power that's somehow orchestrating life here, that power is completely independent of me, does not need my devotion, does not need my faith, doesn't need me to do anything, which is so freeing. For my whole life, I was taught that I would break God's heart if I did something outside of what I was being taught, outside of the control.
[34:31] I talked about those friends growing up who I thought were going to hell because they didn't, like, the weight of responsibility to be a child and be expected to evangelize your friends and convert them. It's crazy. I don't honestly think about God a whole lot. I think one of the biggest things that freed me is that I just, at some point I had the capacity, I think because of, the work I had done in therapy, I had the capacity to just quit believing. Truly and honestly just quit believing.
I don't believe in heaven or hell.
I don't believe in eternal life.
I don't know. And I'm okay with not knowing. You know, the uncertainty is actually a much safer, freer place for me than the certainty that came with high-control religion.
Brandi Fleck:
Wow.
Tia Coffey:
[35:37] Because I don't feel responsible. Yeah. I can simply say, I don't know. I have no idea what's going to happen when I leave this earth. I'm okay with that. Yeah. Because first of all, it's nothing to be afraid of. And that's huge. Yeah. It's almost like you're living more in the present moment. Very much so. Yes. And, you know, a lot of people, like when I'm coaching people, they are so afraid of uncertainty. So I think it's amazing that you've embraced it the way you have because it gives you a sense of freedom. Yeah. Yeah, it's like a detox. From my personality, the weight of responsibility that I felt for what I knew and what I believed, it just weighed me down.
Brandi Fleck:
So we've touched on your divorce a little bit and we've touched on your relationship to a higher power if it is there or if it's not there. What about your other important relationships? What happened to those during this deconstruction?
Tia Coffey:
Well, I have been incredibly fortunate because some people that I'm very close to, girlfriends and sisters, biological sisters...[37:02] Have also been on this deconstruction journey of their own alongside me. And so that gave me a sense of security and support. I was never, so both of my parents have passed, and I was never really able to open up to them about my change in beliefs, but it was okay. Like I didn't have to deceive them or lie because they, I think were also, they left church, like they left going to church. It didn't negatively impact my relationship with them, which I'm really grateful for. And I think that they could see that I was just happier and they were the kind of parents that just wanted that for their children. So if I had told them that I didn't believe in God anymore, that would have really freaked them out though. So I didn't do that. And I'm glad. I don't regret that at all. I think the biggest relationship that changed was the one with myself.
[38:07] You know, I used to be the kind of person that when I was unhappy, I would blame myself. I say I have an overdeveloped sense of responsibility. And I just started loving myself. And that's about as simply as I can put it. I just started loving myself for who I was and not how well I obeyed or submitted or how much I appeared to be good. I think the word that comes up for me a lot is enough. I finally felt like I was enough. Because the church that I grew up in did not make me feel that way, ever. Yeah, that's beautiful. Thank you for sharing. Welcome. It's been good for me to think through some of this again, because obviously I'm still on this journey.
[39:01] I don't know that I ever won't be. I don't think there's a destination, you know, and I'm okay with that too. Like I want to continue becoming who I am and I want to continue to figure out [39:14] what I believe and just, you know, be open to what I don't understand yet.
Help for Deconstructing Your Religious Upbringing
Brandi Fleck:
Well, and for folks who might be on the precipice of deconstructing a religion or thinking that they need to make a change, but it is really hard. I've heard you say things like a support system, having a good therapist, thinking critically, we're all part of your process. And also sort of coming home to yourself, starting to love yourself. Yes. Is there anything else that you would say is part of the deconstruction process?
Tia Coffey:
Yeah. I think you have to find an advocate in yourself when you start to, first of all, it's like believe victims. You are the victim. Believe yourself. If you don't feel okay, if you don't feel safe, if you don't feel like you're living an authentic life, believe yourself.
[40:17] That's very hard to do when you've been raised in this type of religious system because you are taught you cannot trust yourself. You are sinful by nature. You don't know what's best for you. And the thoughts you're having could be coming from Satan himself.
Brandi Fleck:
And what a God? But yeah.
Tia Coffey:
Or it could be God, but you probably need a spiritual leader to help you decipher that.
Brandi Fleck:
Gotcha.
Tia Coffey:
So I would say like, ask yourself:
Am I living authentically?
Do I truly believe what I'm being told or have I been indoctrinated?
And do I have the freedom to challenge the message that I'm hearing or is submission [40:59] and conformity the rule I have to follow in order to be accepted and valued in this community?
Because if you do, then you're in a high-control group. And then I would also say to people that if you're in a toxic or abusive marriage and you do not have support from your church, if you don't have people that you can go to who are supporting you, who want your best interest and safety, then you're also probably in a high-control religious group and you need to get outside the church to get help.
[41:37] You're going to have to just defy them and go outside the church for help.
And I have a couple of quotes that were really important to me when I was going through this that really resonated with me. I started doing a lot of reading outside of the Bible and Christian books, which was another big thing that came out of therapy for me because I had a therapist that was recommending books to me. And Brene Brown was a huge part of my deconstruction and her teachings.
And my favorite quote by Brene Brown is “talk to yourself like someone you love.”
And then this is a longer one. I'm actually, I have it. I have it here. I'm going to read it. This is from The Curious Case of Benjamin Button. A lot of people will be familiar with this quote.
“For what it's worth, it's never too late, or in my case, too early to be whoever you want to be. There's no time limit. Stop whenever you want. You can change or stay the same. There are no rules to this thing. We can make the best or the worst of it. I hope you make the best of it. And I hope you see things that startle you. I hope you feel things you never felt before. I hope you meet people with a different point of view. I hope you live a life you're proud of. And if you find that you're not, I hope you have the strength to start all over again.”
Brandi Fleck:
Beautiful.
Tia Coffey:
[42:56] I have a lot of books that I've also read that I don't know if you like put recommendations in your show notes, but I would be happy to share some of the books that were really helpful to me during this process.
Brandi Fleck:
Yeah, I would love to put some of those in the show notes. Do you know any of what they are like off the top of your head?
Tia Coffey:
For sure.
A big one is Rob Bell's Love Wins.
Anything by Brene Brown was very helpful to me.
And then Sue Monk Kidd. She's most well known for the book, The Bees Book. I can't think of the name of it, but she is, I believe she calls herself a Christian feminist. She has two books.
One is called When the Heart Waits
and the other is called The Dissident Daughter, The Dance of the Dissident Daughter.
And both of those books were really pivotal for me.
Brandi Fleck:
Okay. Yeah, we'll definitely link to those in the show notes.
Tia Coffey:
[43:48] The Secret Life of Bees. That's the book that she's, they made it into a movie she's best known for.
Brandi Fleck:
Okay, cool.
[43:56] Well, is there anything that we have not talked about today that you think is important to share?
Tia Coffey:
I mean, if I were sitting talking to somebody who was early on in this journey, I would just reiterate, just trust yourself. You can trust yourself. You're not a horrible sinner full of fleshly desires that doesn't know what's best for yourself. You actually have a lot of intuition and you can do this, be brave, fight for yourself.
Brandi Fleck:
Beautiful. Tia, thank you so much for coming on the show today and for sharing your story.
Tia Coffey:
Thanks for having me.
Join the conversation!
Feel free to share your own experience and let me know if you have any questions in the comments.
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Hi, I’m the founder of Human Amplified. I’m Brandi Fleck, a recognized communications and interviewing expert, a writer, an artist, and a private practice, certified trauma-informed life coach and trauma recovery coach. No matter how you interact with me, I help you tell and change your story so you can feel more like yourself. So welcome!
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